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Feedback on update 0.7

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The game they originally had was very good at the core. Instead of fixing the big issues that are still here today like gutshot as a example.

Should of left the game the way it was and worked on refining a good game design it instead of trying to change it each patch. I think I saw somewhere that they were going to increase the flinching in the game too for some reason. They keep compounding the problems in this game.

When this game started we had a direction from the Q and A. Also could see what type of game they were going for. But they keep going back on things and wanting to add this or that. To messy right now.

 

Problems with the game design at launch was-

squads weren't really doing anything special. It was like a empty mechanic that got you points but wasn't really game content.

Streaks where cool until you used them. A lot of the streaks were let downs and had no oompf. Lack luster content that was a big part of the game.

Vehicle play was kinda shallow. You get in a tank and wreck people while occasionally playing cat and mouse with RPGs while listening for strikes.  Lack luster content.

Spawns were a huge issue that got a better but were still bad. So many different paths to fix them like making the squad rally point. but instead they went with uninteractive team spawning.

 

There more but really should have stayed with the BF like game that had lots of freedom with your loadout. Instead of fixing the parts that were lack luster content they changed and adjusted the good parts of the game and the whole direction for the game is all over the place. 

I really like how they were describing the game near launch. Was hoping for a BF 4 game that didnt cater to casual players as much as BF 1 did. A little more challanging then BF4. And would fix or not include most of the problems in game design that BF4.

6 hours ago, tynblpb said:

And max what I would agree about shared CD if it would be shared by squadmembers, not teammates. Sometimes, when playing wth decdent squad I end up with 10k unused BP. I don;t know how much it would be with teamshared CD.

And in 0.7 these kicks IMO are within reason.

 

Im not entirely 100% on a shared BP system but I do think it can be a good idea.

I disagree with the .7 gunplay being diffrent. It did seem like it changed a bit but theres not much really. Gunplay always feels diffrent on PTE then Live even on the same patch. which is a another testing problem that needs to be accounted for. in the .3 PTE the gunplay felt totally off and random even know there was no change besides optimization.

 There is still sway which is the biggest problem with this games gunplay. Reducing it to where it does not effect the players control but still gives a bit deviation at range is acceptable. Like pixels of sway which could just be accounted for with recoil.

If they removed the sway we could see how much the horizontal kick is. Having a gun kick to the left and right as much as it does is way too much. Should be limited to one direction and spread and be the variation factor like most other games.

The kick right now is enough to deviate you aim of the heads of players. Far away for me is pixels, close up is in a room and even in a room it can bounce you aim off of a players body.But its more about the feel and control you have over the gun.

 

Not talking about every class of gun here. There's room for special mechanics on like LMGs which in the past were not as strong as ARs because how accurate and effective ARs were at killing vs a LMG which was strong in other ways and play styles. I would of liked to see more custom rules for LMGs in the old build.

 

 

 

9 hours ago, tynblpb said:

And TZoningHard want the 0.3 times when due to bad hitreg everyone were bulletsponges.

No, I don't want it.

But it'll be interesting if devs for short period would revert recoil patterns on PTE to what they were in 0.3. Just to refresh memories.

Yes I would rather have .3 with every bug it had. Give me falling through maps, give me messed up ammo counter, give me crashes, I would even take the hit reg issues. The hittreg issues artificially raised the TTK and make the game more interesting since there was a challenge gun play. So I actually liked the Hitreg issues when it made me take a tiny bit more time to kill a player. Not condoning bad hitreg but .3 was a great time then .4 happen the game started going down hill. Fixed the bugs and hitreg but adjusted the gunplay for no reason.

Would prefer the much better later patches of the .3 where all thos problems were fixed tho!

Big Brain game deving where you make changes to the games gunplay after the past month was a hitreg shit show and you had no data to properly adjust the game off of and everything went to shit after being told "hey guys its not wise to make gameplay adjustments when you dont have a proper base line and data to adjust from."

 

Shameless plug on videos from .3.3ish patches era as a example of the game then. Notice how smooth the gunplay was.

 

But people still were in no way bullet sponges in .3 as the videos above show that people dropped really fast in .3 . It was 3 gutshots/back shots to kill or 4 head shots. You could let off 5 shots in less then half a second which would kill most people when all rounds hit. If some on is complaining about bullet sponge in .3 when the TTK was still a low it was because of personal aim or hitreg. TTK that could have been so much better with 1 more BTK. 

A 30 round mag could kill 6 people. I remember being low on ammo with 16 in the mag and killing 4 full health people from that mag along.

 

Ive argued for a BTK of 4 + 1/2 for base armor for the center of the chest and then 6 for outside the area the plate would cover. 3 + 1 for head shots.

I think that 4 armors are too much if you are going to try to make a it +1 BTK per level. The difference from the first level to the last would be to much as players need a relatively constant TTK range to expect each time they engage a target. Other wise you get the pseudo RNG problem.

I did like the idea they had where armor would provide +1 or +2 depending on the caliber. But it should be 3 level for ease of design.

 

I want the game to have headshots always to be the goto if you are good enough where the BTK will never be greater then chest shots unless it was back shot in the vitals perhaps. To have head shots be valuable they need to be 2 BTK less so having them 1.5BTK less on average can suffice other wise the meager .09 somthing time between head and chest so minimal its not substantial to attempt.

But head shots cant be too low or the game suffers from insta kill situations and cheesy twitch gameplay. Also some guns would be just to OP in a situation where 1-2 head shots could kill. Science and mathimatics can find the goldy locks zone for good competitive gunplay.

 

 

I would really love if they reverted the PTE to the old gunplay tho. That would be the best thing ever!!!

sorry for how long winded this part was.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

I think we can all agree that we were expecting a BF game and were hyped for that. We have no idea about the direction of this game or where is heading anymore.

I would like to know their end goal but I think they dont have one and might be shooting blind. I just notice that we dont have a road map anymore aswell.

 

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Nahhh only having vertical recoil with no horizontal kicks would ruin the gunplay

No thanks 

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[IMPROVEMENTS]

  • Changed low shadow settings to remove glowing characters and vehicles in dark areas and improve their quality,

And some faggots on steam say devs do not listen to feedback.

noshadow.gif

Can't wait to see how it looks now.

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I hope that newly added shadows mechanics is rly-rly unoptimized. Because it torpedoes my FPS. Squadscreen in the end of the match and my FPS dropped to 9...

20190831004943_1.thumb.jpg.f50784680e7707b913d7174db874e186.jpg

Цитата

Fixed direction prioritization when exiting a vehicle,

For those who don't know. Now u usually bail out BEHIND the vehicles.

20190831005402_1.jpg.e6e64eb32ebd27e825229ef7d3bc86bd.jpg

 

So, ur vehicle now covers u from enemy's firing. BUT! There is 1 very important but.

U bail out behind the vehicle if it's was moving forward. If vehicle was moving backwards u'll bail out on the left side of the vehicle.

20190831005339_1.jpg.5c4e26d0286be763f82e140e2c855837.jpg

And here comes this BUT. Game interprets the LAST PRESSED BUTTON (W or S) BEFORE BAILING OUT AS THE JUSTIFICATION WHERE U'LL FIND URSELF WHEN EXITING VEHICLE.

So, even if u've pressed S button for a split second before exiting the vehice, u'll find urself on the left side of the vehicle and not behind it. And the chances u'll be killed are much higher in that situation.

So, take it plz into account when playing in vehicle in 0.7PTE patch.

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TTK is not a problem for me, since 0.3 its been more or less the same shit, with hitreg issues making it look worse in the past. The problem is in gunplay with the recoil and artificial sway, jumping left to right, a terrible mechanic which was implemented for terrible reasons. But hopefully, they know by now just how bad it is, and revert to the old system or create a better version of the old system. I mean they said they've worked with the military before, so they could work with them to make the weapons perform accurately, with no need for artificial gimmicks. 

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49 minutes ago, Artaxiad300062 said:

TTK is not a problem for me, since 0.3 its been more or less the same shit, with hitreg issues making it look worse in the past. The problem is in gunplay with the recoil and artificial sway, jumping left to right, a terrible mechanic which was implemented for terrible reasons. But hopefully, they know by now just how bad it is, and revert to the old system or create a better version of the old system. I mean they said they've worked with the military before, so they could work with them to make the weapons perform accurately, with no need for artificial gimmicks. 

I loved when this game launched because I am a avid shooter and the guns preformed really realistically. There was no gimmicks and it was so much like shooting real life gun. The had appropriate drop even tho its was 1/3 of real drop, had appropriate projectile speed, had unnoticeable recoil, The kick was more then IRL but you need some challenge to the game play, and the

Sway doesn't make it more realistic at all. In real life sway is so minimal it doesnt matter in even in noticed. sway would throw off a shot less then a inch at distance and isn't even noticeable most of the time.If we are playing solders they should know how to shoot a gun and have training with it. Also in IRL sway is predictable infinity symbol shaped pattern and its taught in the competition target shooting circles to wait for the sway to come back the the center. When I did notice sway in competition it was a predictable figure 8 sway pattern. Even then it would only cause me to hit the 9 ring instead of the 10. I wouldn't take me out of the black of the target.

The simulations they made were VR and the operators who used them used held co2 blowback guns that were hooked up to the VR systems most likely. I used something similar called a ISMIT in the Marines where you shoot a projected image with a CO2 blow back M16. But the guns in those games were real life objects. The devs would have no input from that into how weapons performed. They went to ranges to get a feel for weapons but they are gun noobs, not soldiers. I was still pretty impressive how they made guns preform at launch.

I think its funny AF that they make changes to make bullets "feel" more realistic then adjust gun performance making it feel less realistic to balance it out.
 

 

3 hours ago, tynblpb said:

I hope that newly added shadows mechanics is rly-rly unoptimized. Because it torpedoes my FPS. Squadscreen in the end of the match and my FPS dropped to 9..


I ran low shadows because of optimization, the I never noticed any gameplay advantages besides having better frames then other players.

I turn lighting to low for a advantage not shadows.

In most games when you turn lighting to the lowest levels is makes the color pallet more simple and the game brighter. Its way easier to seem other players when there is less shading going on. Lighting usually has little impact on performance so the best way to make a game look better with less cost to performance is upping the lighting.

IDK why they would change shadows. Its not what gives the advantage. I would love to not play with blocky shadows bu I run a AMD card. Even if its a Vega64 it doesn't like shadows in any game. Low shadows actually make it harder to see players in some cases because of the sharp cut off hinders identifying players. If they wanted to nerf using low settings for advantages then go after lighting not shadows.

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Just did more tests.

There have been no noticeable changes to gun control mechanics. from .6 to .7.
I have not tested the differences in grips but I heard they might have not been add yet. I will test grips further later I got too much irl work.
 

There is not any noticeable spread to weapons while you are ADS as well. If there is it is a very small amount.

The sway is the culprit. There is some horizontal recoil but it seems to be consistent pulling to one direction and not the issue. So adjusting horizontal recoil will not fix the issue.

image.thumb.png.6d26486ea6d595cd1189eb706dd40059.png

-The example above is a M416 with cobra grip. All below applies to M416 patterns. Sway also seems to be a constant thing that the gun is always following paths even while not ADS so it could be different each time you ADS.-

 

How sway is working on .7 and .6 is there are several paths in either a clockwise or counter clockwise path that can change direction. Changes in direction which would be going from clock wise to counter clock wise normally don't happen but when it does it will try to keep the same direction from then on.

There is a trend to move in a direction of (x,y) -5,-5 to 0,1 in this example (but it could also be mirrored to the right instead of favoring the left for even the same gun). This is as much as 3 degrees change in direction horizontally. But that trend can be change to be mirrored to favor the right instead of the left similar to how direction changes from clock wise to counter clock wise.

When the sway starts there will be a shape it will follow as example the red shape. The path will complete one revolution of a shape. It takes 6s to complete a path on a shape. The red shape it takes 3 seconds for it to get 0,0 to -5,5 and the full path takes 6 seconds. It then changes to a different shape and possibly even direction.

Shapes are random, the speed the path will follow varies depending on how sharp the curve it is coming up on is. When the path is coming to the end parts of the red it will slow down. The paths also slows down when a shape is about to change.

The way the path shifts from one shape to another is that it morphs the first 1/4th of the old shape till it aligns somewhere on the new shape. The point where the the shapes touch is now the start point and the new shape will make a full revolution then restart a new direction

 

This means when trying to control sway you have to react to changes is in direction and speed.

A example for a more circular path is that you will always have to change direction. You have no idea if the circles path will go up/down or left/right the next split second. While a more elongated shape it will have a predictable path on two sides of the shape but there are abrupt changes to speed that you have to react to but you will have a high chance of going in the reverse direction.

So the sway is completely random and on controlable. A player will only be able to react after they have perceived the sway and then have to wait for the sway to follow a path before they can react. By the time they can react the path will change in either direction or speed. The player is always behind the sway trying to follow it but it is IMPOSSIBLE to control sway or mitigate the sway enough.



There was no sway in .3 or previous. This is the culprit.

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28 минут назад, TZoningHard сказал:

The player is always behind the sway trying to follow it but it is IMPOSSIBLE to control sway or mitigate the sway enough.

Disagree. I tried it, and it's controllable enough to give single fire headshots even standing ( when you prone, sway reduces). And on closer range sway is almost negligible.

Over this, I'd like to see sway in hipfire instead of nowadays enourmous hipfire spread. With laser sight (and without grey dot), player will take more control on hipfire, if laser sight shows, real direction bullet goes.

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Single fire and burst fire modes also give recoil reduction 

I like the current gunplay with the horizontal recoil. I've played games with almost 0 to exactly 0 horizontal recoil and it completly ruins the gunplay. 

Sure it's not perfect currently but so far imo it's the best version since launch 

Edited by Salt Lord

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20 minutes ago, †FeuerEuphorie† said:

Disagree. I tried it, and it's controllable enough to give single fire headshots even standing ( when you prone, sway reduces). And on closer range sway is almost negligible.

Over this, I'd like to see sway in hipfire instead of nowadays enourmous hipfire spread. With laser sight (and without grey dot), player will take more control on hipfire, if laser sight shows, real direction bullet goes.

Can you show how it is different? I can give 5 single headshots standing in both versions. Also what does prone have to do with anything you barely prone.

You dont understand the problem is that the sway is completely unpredictable. You aim in at something and you aim is getting pulled to the ,left ,right ,up or down unlike recoil which has a general direction and pattern to follow meaning you actually have control over the weapon.

You point the laser at the player but the next thing is you dont know if it is going to pull right or left untill it starts then you dont know for how long or how fast till it has already happen. Its RNG based gameplay, skill can only help you out so much with this.

 

Recoil is not a issue in the game its completely controllable to a appropriate degree for good gameplay. It could even be a bit higher vertically.

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9 минут назад, TZoningHard сказал:

You dont understand the problem is that the sway is completely unpredictable.

It's slow enough to move your mouse in opposite direction. And enemies head is more, than single dot. 2-3 pixels away don't really make the weather.

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3 hours ago, †FeuerEuphorie† said:

It's slow enough to move your mouse in opposite direction. And enemies head is more, than single dot. 2-3 pixels away don't really make the weather.

I really don't see a good reason behind defending a bad aspect of the game. The sway is random barrel deviation, you cannot control it, can you still get kills? Yes, you can still get kills. This is not the problem that is being pointed out, the problem is the sway itself, an artificial recoil mechanic added to guns around 0.4  patch. Before this patch, you had much more engaging gunplay, the recoil was accurate to real life, and you would scroll down with the mouse to control most of the recoil... This isn't the case right now, you do still control some of that recoil, but there is the added sway mechanic that messes with it and it was done mainly to stop people from going fully auto in medium ranges... I mean all they had to do to improve this system is google search which gun has a recoil deviation either left or right, and added that to each weapon with also some accurate to real life vertical recoil... This would have made the gunplay near perfect, by now if they added the animations rework, the game would have felt top notch, whereas it feels like bf4 with funny recoil patterns that take alot of the fun out of the gunplay and having control over where your shots land. 

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4 hours ago, TZoningHard said:

Just did more tests.

There have been no noticeable changes to gun control mechanics. from .6 to .7.
I have not tested the differences in grips but I heard they might have not been add yet. I will test grips further later I got too much irl work.
 

There is not any noticeable spread to weapons while you are ADS as well. If there is it is a very small amount.

The sway is the culprit. There is some horizontal recoil but it seems to be consistent pulling to one direction and not the issue. So adjusting horizontal recoil will not fix the issue.

image.thumb.png.6d26486ea6d595cd1189eb706dd40059.png

-The example above is a M416 with cobra grip. All below applies to M416 patterns. Sway also seems to be a constant thing that the gun is always following paths even while not ADS so it could be different each time you ADS.-

 

How sway is working on .7 and .6 is there are several paths in either a clockwise or counter clockwise path that can change direction. Changes in direction which would be going from clock wise to counter clock wise normally don't happen but when it does it will try to keep the same direction from then on.

There is a trend to move in a direction of (x,y) -5,-5 to 0,1 in this example (but it could also be mirrored to the right instead of favoring the left for even the same gun). This is as much as 3 degrees change in direction horizontally. But that trend can be change to be mirrored to favor the right instead of the left similar to how direction changes from clock wise to counter clock wise.

When the sway starts there will be a shape it will follow as example the red shape. The path will complete one revolution of a shape. It takes 6s to complete a path on a shape. The red shape it takes 3 seconds for it to get 0,0 to -5,5 and the full path takes 6 seconds. It then changes to a different shape and possibly even direction.

Shapes are random, the speed the path will follow varies depending on how sharp the curve it is coming up on is. When the path is coming to the end parts of the red it will slow down. The paths also slows down when a shape is about to change.

The way the path shifts from one shape to another is that it morphs the first 1/4th of the old shape till it aligns somewhere on the new shape. The point where the the shapes touch is now the start point and the new shape will make a full revolution then restart a new direction

 

This means when trying to control sway you have to react to changes is in direction and speed.

A example for a more circular path is that you will always have to change direction. You have no idea if the circles path will go up/down or left/right the next split second. While a more elongated shape it will have a predictable path on two sides of the shape but there are abrupt changes to speed that you have to react to but you will have a high chance of going in the reverse direction.

So the sway is completely random and on controlable. A player will only be able to react after they have perceived the sway and then have to wait for the sway to follow a path before they can react. By the time they can react the path will change in either direction or speed. The player is always behind the sway trying to follow it but it is IMPOSSIBLE to control sway or mitigate the sway enough.



There was no sway in .3 or previous. This is the culprit.

Nice research man! Pretty much what I was suspecting (and somewhere in this forum there should be posts of me about it :D).

It is possible to land single fire headshots and counter the sway that's true. The problem I would say is the inconsistency the sway brings due to the changing patterns. I had moments in CQB where I was suddenly thrown off target before starting to shoot because the sway behaved differently than the moments before. This is a problem in my opinion.

I love to run the M417 with a moderate magnification scope. If I want to countersnipe someone behind cover on long range and the only thing that stops me from doing it is the sway because I have to hit like one or two pixels it becomes really annoying. That's why I was suggesting a sway reducing attachement once.

I think the current amount of sway could be used to balance LMGs and heavy SRs so that you will be forced somewhat to go prone and bipod. But for ARs, BRs, SMGs etc. I would suggest an overall reduction of the sway. In any case and for every gun I would argue for a more predictable/simple sway pattern.

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1 час назад, Artaxiad300062 сказал:

I really don't see a good reason behind defending a bad aspect of the game.

Sway and flinch are only two mechanics now, that prevents snipers from fully dominates the battlefield. In BF4 I tired from sniper apes and DMR monkeys, who didn't take/defend the CP, but only looking for frags. Sway (and its reduction, when prone) is way to force snipers to lie down instead of being strafing right-left nearby impossible to hit target.

 

3 часа назад, HeiligeRobbe сказал:

I think the current amount of sway could be used to balance LMGs and heavy SRs so that you will be forced somewhat to go prone and bipod. But for ARs, BRs, SMGs etc. I would suggest an overall reduction of the sway. In any case and for every gun I would argue for a more predictable/simple sway pattern.

I have some "brainstorming" idea about this.

 

 

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0.7.2 is a gamechanger for me. Game runs really smooth on ultra. Finally :)

GREAT JOB!

Also I cannot see myself on the map while being in a tank ;)

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28 минут назад, roderick сказал:

Also I cannot see myself on the map while being in a tank ;)

If it's the default tank that is on the base, it's pretty much usual. U need to bail out and get in and then game would recognize u and start showing icon minimap.

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6 hours ago, †FeuerEuphorie† said:

Sway and flinch are only two mechanics now, that prevents snipers from fully dominates the battlefield. In BF4 I tired from sniper apes and DMR monkeys, who didn't take/defend the CP, but only looking for frags. Sway (and its reduction, when prone) is way to force snipers to lie down instead of being strafing right-left nearby impossible to hit target.

That may be a good mechanic for nerfing snipers as they are still pretty strong in 0.7, but it is bad overall for most weapons. 

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A comparison  video. The has the same trends and deviations on the pull of the aim. There is also a bug on AK-15 that at a certain point causes the pattern to level out and make a straight line.

This is because the Vertical recoil disappears along with sway but horizontal recoil stays in effect.

I say this because sway has both horizontal and vertical movements while the path of the patterns is going mainly to the right but will jump to the left occasionally. If that was sway then it would be less jumpy as well as have vertical movement. You can see how stable the aimer is at that point. 

Ive done a test where I put a book on my table to make sure I could only pull down on the mouse and what happened was a pattern was present similar to the sway moving the pattern about far far larger then the bug pattern in this video.

 

Look at .3 no sway bolters werent that good every one used ARs. The big issue here is the targets are too big which is the issue for the majority of the game. A bolter can gut shot for a insta kill and so can a AR since the TTK is so low it seems as if it was a insta kill. That is the problem here not lack of flinch as a excuse for players being bad.

 


-No to flinch-

ARs already have a huge advantage of Bolters. The main issue with bolters is the insta kills to the chest but if something happens and it doesn't kill them in the first shot you are screwed.

The difference in TTK between a AR and Bolter is only .28-.38 of a second. ARs are almost insta kills already but they have a lot less risk. If you get the first shot off you are gonna win anyways.

Flinch will only work if the bolter is shot first so it doesn't make any sense as the bolter will already be dead and wont balance the game at all.

Every game that did flinch was a disaster. What happens if it only reinforce who shot who first win mentality that already exist further limiting skill and counter play. It makes it were even if you are a bad shot you are given so many bonuses for getting the first shot off that the enemy cant fight back in anyway.

We can already say its a terrible Idea because it is a terrible Idea in other games. Just like we can say sway is a terrible Idea because as players we experinced these mechanics already to have knowledge on them.

 

 

The games already been killed you guys just keep shooting it with changes like adding flinch. Flinch was very very hated in BF for a reason, Same for planetside 2 before that reduced it but forced players to run implants to further reduce it to make the game playable. You get shot first and you completely have no chance to win after that, completely destroys games by taking the game out of the players hands after they are shot. But the devs dont care about feedback so it will probably get added anyway and the game will get even worse.

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10 минут назад, TZoningHard сказал:

Flinch will only work if the bolter is shot first so it doesn't make any sense as the bolter will already be dead and wont balance the game at all.

Works only for CQC. Well, if there are perv3rts who go CQC with Sniper rifle hoping/expecting/counting to win knowing that there would be only 1 chance to win firefight - I don't think this kind of behavior should be promoted by removing the flinch.

On long ranges 1tapping with AR vs Sniper rifle gives the chance to AR carrier not to die fast. Though strafing increases those chances much more.

 

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23 минуты назад, TZoningHard сказал:

Flinch was very very hated in BF for a reason

 

8 часов назад, †FeuerEuphorie† сказал:

In BF4 I tired from sniper apes and DMR monkeys

That's the reason. Half of BF players are camping rats, unfortunately. They don't want to be flinched, because they won't be able to use their lovely bolters.

 

0.38 second it's enought to AK-15 does 4 more shots. An additional frag in most shooters. It is very large time.

27 минут назад, TZoningHard сказал:

It makes it were even if you are a bad shot you are given so many bonuses for getting the first shot off that the enemy cant fight back in anyway.

First shot - first kill, no dancing under machineguns suppression?

To be honest, I often kill people, which started to shoot me before I shot them, Why? First, I use ceramic/steel armor, and second - I use covers, like walls, obstacles,ect,
In addition, WW3 is teamgame (surprise). And guy, who suppress you, can be suppressed by your teammate.

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29 minutes ago, tynblpb said:

Works only for CQC. Well, if there are perv3rts who go CQC with Sniper rifle hoping/expecting/counting to win knowing that there would be only 1 chance to win firefight - I don't think this kind of behavior should be promoted by removing the flinch.

On long ranges 1tapping with AR vs Sniper rifle gives the chance to AR carrier not to die fast. Though strafing increases those chances much more.

 

So you are demeaning a play style that a lot of people like because it is challenging. People enjoy CQB bolting because its harder then being a noob with a AR in easy mode. 
CQB bolting will not in anyway being hurt by flinch because CQB bolters win by shooting first not 2nd, and not after they missed. With all Bolters players dont hardscope unless they are bad players.

The majority of CQC bolting is snap shooting with a flick or quick scoping. The amount of time spent ADS with a bolter is just enough to get the shot off. For a Bolter to even get affected by flinch is such a minuscule window that it would rarely happen in the first place as aiming with a bolter happens before you ADS.

CQB bolters arent tanking shots from ARs, then shooting them once with the bolter. Flinch would only help the CQB bolters as if they dont insta kill the other player is flinched making not way less risky.

 

The issue is AR v AR ect... Where its just who shot who first would win every time or who had the highest rate of fire weapon to cause the most flinch would win. We have already experienced flinch in other games.


If you are are one tapping with a AR for long range you arent a good shot. The recoil is controllable would be the only reason to onetap which there is absolutely ZERO reason to one tap in this game. Sway is not effected by players one tapping at all and that is the reason players would miss at any range first and foremost. A AR is still very very competitive against bolters at any range in this game you Ive out sniped many snipers with just a AK-15. Its the players problem that they couldnt handle a player with a bolter not because of any game mechanic.

 

Also need to state that sway does not hurt Bolters since you dont stay in ADS for long when you do make you shots so sways impact is negligible. Sway only hurts weapons that have to ADS for a periods of time. 

 

You do not understand a single thing talking about. You should go learn how to play FPS games before making statements so incorrect.

 

11 minutes ago, †FeuerEuphorie† said:

 

That's the reason. Half of BF players are camping rats, unfortunately. They don't want to be flinched, because they won't be able to use their lovely bolters.

First shot - first kill, no dancing under machineguns suppression?

Dude that is so wrong. For one you guys are just trying to shit on better players and are trying to nerf skill.

Two you guys are so incorrect about what would nerf bolters because flinch in no way will. It will only hurt ARs.

And thrid you really hate having to use skill dont you. Cant aim on a moving target so you need to make the game easy mode in order to get a kill. This is why the game is dead.

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3 минуты назад, TZoningHard сказал:

For one you guys are just trying to shit on better players and are trying to nerf skill.

Never said, that I'm the best player, but definitly not the worst. Usually 1-2 places on TDM and enough good at WZ within players, who don't use vehicles.

Best player is that who uses all aspects of the game to win. And man, who jerks of 100500 hours only to learn aim in sterile conditions, and suffers after by flinch, sway and suppression can be named as a "good player". Just an aimjerker?

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7 минут назад, TZoningHard сказал:

ou do not understand a single thing talking about. You should go learn how to play FPS games before making statements so incorrect.

Sorry, but u, with ur mlgprogosusniping on Warsaw TDM with red-dot or iron sights on G29 wouldn't win a fight or defend CP against 2 guys with AR or MGs. Me, with my Pecheneg, on the contrary, can do it. So, plz, don't mix ur CQC TDM experience with WZ objective playing. 

And FFS I'm running with x4 scope. I see sway. I flinch when being hit. I see kicks when shooting full-auto. All this affect shooting only on long distances. And on long distances u can't kill anyone fast if only u r not lying down with bipoded gun. 

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5 minutes ago, tynblpb said:

Sorry, but u, with ur mlgprogosusniping on Warsaw TDM with red-dot or iron sights on G29 wouldn't win a fight or defend CP against 2 guys with AR or MGs. Me, with my Pecheneg, on the contrary, can do it. So, plz, don't mix ur CQC TDM experience with WZ objective playing. 

You sound upset and have a shity attitude.

And yes I can defend a objective with a Bolter, your statement is untter nonsense and doesn't even apply to any thing. 

You assume that I only play bolter, I play every thing and have knowledge in all the weapons. I play more with a AR then a bolter. Your shitty attitude and degrading statements dont prove anything or make any points.

I am a Warzone player, I do not like TDM and I only play it when I had to. Warzone is not some high and mighty big brain game mode at all either. All you do is kill players on points and then go to the next point.

You make up BS about me not doing something that you have no idea I do.

You try to say thing like I cant kill players at long range unless I prone and bipod. I certainly can and do kill players at long ranges in the standing position because I have good aim. I out snipe snipers with red dont ARs who are over 100m away with out needing flinch.

 

If you are correct then show proof.

 

21 minutes ago, †FeuerEuphorie† said:

Never said, that I'm the best player, but definitly not the worst. Usually 1-2 places on TDM and enough good at WZ within players, who don't use vehicles.

Best player is that who uses all aspects of the game to win. And man, who jerks of 100500 hours only to learn aim in sterile conditions, and suffers after by flinch, sway and suppression can be named as a "good player". Just an aimjerker?

So I am not a good player? I'm pretty sure I'm known to be a good player and have videos on youtube showing this.

You are just talking trash about the person instead of trying to argue against the points the person brought up.



Trying to down play skill as not being actually being skill. But some how trying to saying that a mechanic that takes control of the weapon out of the players hands is some how creating a different type of skill. If you cant control it and are only reacting to it after it has occurred then how is that even application of skill. It is letter ally preventing skill and preventing gameplay by removing your control through RNG. 

It makes the game easier for bad players by lowering how much skill can affect control of the weapon. That is the only thing that is going on. Sway, Flinch, and suppression are mechanics designed to make bad players feel less bad by nerfing skill with RNG.

 

Do you still say that the gun control changed from .6 to .7 or did you give up and are just attempting to dodges the discussion.

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