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8 hours ago, MFC_Plowing said:

@Zvolteh also one rpg can/will kill a tank

Do you mean in game or IRL? In game they do (at least unmodified vehicles/ MBT), IRL generally they don't or very, very rarely do destroy a modernized MBT. There's a story and I can't remember if it was the 1st or 2nd Gulf war of a Abrams MBT taking I think 7 (I may be mistaken) RPG's obviously the tank was f****d but the crew were ok, lived to tell the story and fight another day.

On a side note I find snipers OHK to the stomach almost game breaking in terms of balance, it doesn't take any skill to shoot someone in the stomach (1 of the largest parts of the body), particularly from distance; yet snipers are rewarded with a OHK. Only thing that should be OHK by snipers is face/ headshot.

Careful what you wish for if we're going down the road of nerfing as balance, every nerf normally requires something else to be nerfed; until eventually everything's nerfed.

I strongly believe that vehicles should be a powerful combat multiplier (especially considering WW3's mechanic of earning them rather than them just spawning every 60-90 seconds). Currently they are getting weaker and weaker with every (major) patch thus making them a less effective and appealing combat multiplier.

Edited by VoodooGaming
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19 minutes ago, VoodooGaming said:

On a side note I find snipers OHK to the stomach almost game breaking in terms of balance, it doesn't take any skill to shoot someone in the stomach (1 of the largest parts of the body), particularly from distance; yet snipers are rewarded with a OHK. Only thing that should be OHK by snipers is face/ headshot.

All gut shots feel like you got sniped.

I dont feel like much is earned now with how much points we get.

Tanks are nerfed enough and might need more protection along with a nerf to RPG handling and ammo.

It might be a cool concept to have the crew live though the tank being incapacitated by some ways but not all. A big thing for some tanks is crew survivalbility.

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i like people that don't play tanks speak up about tanks.... just wonders/

HE/SH are for killing infantry BEHIND COVER, large grups of infantry or for long range engagements, thats their role! If i would want to kill someone in direct fire i would use IFV with auto-canon. How to fight a tank? Fire RPG and RUN like hell, don't sit behind convenient corner and then write that 4m spash on HE/SH is to much!

IMO the biggest threat to infantry are coaxial .50! Actually I got most of my kills with this thing! If anything devs should switch it for 7.62 MG but bring HE shells that made tanks usefully. You can even up BP cost even more and add reload time for HE i don't care, just make High caliber guns viable again!

At this point, i can't fight other tanks, IFV, APCs/ noone brings them its better to just call ARTY or other type of fire support/ i have to shot to infantry with APFSDS, HE have to much drop/travel time to be useful, my turret turns 0.5 of speed RL tanks are capable of. Forum is complaining about players that ARE good at armored warfare because this game also attracted such players and BF/CoD players are getting the biggest support though YOU wanted game that will be diferent than thopse two titles.

Right now mechanics that differentiates you from BF is BP mechanic, body-armor and a bit better customization 

You can as well remove tanks and guns above 57mm 

Devs tell me what kind of game are you making? 

Edited by Marg
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10 minutes ago, Marg said:

i like people that don't play tanks speak up about tanks.... just wonders/

HE/SH are for killing infantry BEHIND COVER, large grups of infantry or for long range engagements that their role! If i would want to kill someone in direct fire i would use IFV with auto-canon. How to fight a tank? Fire RPG and RUN like hell, don't sit behind conviniet corner and then write that 4m spash on HE/SH is to much!

IMO the biggest threat to infantry are coaxial .50! Actually I got most of my kills with this thing! If anything devs should switch it for 7.62 MG but bring HE shells that made tanks usefully. You can even up BP cost even more and add reload time for HE i don't care, just make High caliber guns viable again!

Please don't up BP cost even more, I can't afford to call in anything more than a barebone tank or marginally upgraded APC most games as is with how things are now.  (I'm usually mid-to-upper score on my teams too, for the record.)  

Edited by Evaris

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21 minutes ago, Evaris said:

Please don't up BP cost even more, I can't afford to call in anything more than a barebone tank or marginally upgraded APC most games as is with how things are now.  (I'm usually mid-to-upper score on my teams too, for the record.)  

i know but what is right now is even more ridiculous.

edit

Devs could down BP cost of tanks, so more players could bring such vehicles yet they are not viable right now

2edit

to hell with it, just infantry with sniper rifles and quad-bikes/ scrap all the work you put into other types of vehicles 

Edited by Marg

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4 hours ago, Marg said:

i like people that don't play tanks speak up about tanks.... just wonders/

I was playing as infantry and I'm awesome but a tank killed me; so tanks must be OP, please nerf the tanks because they kill me... But it's good that I can 1 shot people in the gut with my sniper rifle from the edge of the map and get a kill ? ? ?

^I'm being sarcastic btw ?

It seems to me these people complaining forget that we all have to play as infantry, which means we all have to deal with vehicles on the enemy team and that vehicles\ strikes are a incentive and reward for playing well as infantry. If these people spend their BP on something different to vehicles or offensive strikes then that's cool, but they shouldn't cry when a tank rolls up on their position and they don't have anything to directly counter it besides the 1-3 freely available tandem RPG's it normally takes to destroy even the heaviest of tanks and its occupants which is apparently just too hard for them.

 

Vehicles/ MBT's are way to weak on the defensive side of thing's, on the offensive side of thing's maybe the previous splash damage was a little too much but in its current form there just isn't enough splash damage from either SH or HE rounds (at least on my Terminator) for it to fulfill its roll of supporting other vehicles and infantry, if you have to basically score a direct hit with SH/HE to kill then you'd might as well just use either the 7.62 or the 12.7mm and not have to worry about reload time. I mean if I park my vehicle on the edge of the map with its rear facing the edge of the map and fire on an enemy held objective as they spawn I can rack up the kills but is this really the intended and proper use of a vehicle, I don't see how I'm helping my team like this; kills hardly make any difference to the outcome of a round...

Agreed that within the WW3 playerbase there will be vehicle experts with many hours of experience with vehicles in other games, while I wouldn't consider myself an expert in vehicles (I have friends who are real experts) I do have probably 2000 hours (maybe more) of time just spent in vehicles alone out of my over 5000 hours between Bf3 & Bf4.

 

"Devs tell me what kind of game are you making?" I quote the steam store page " The most authentic bullet vs. armor system in the FPS genre to date, achieved through years of research and development with military professionals. Ballistics, a weight system, full body awareness, vehicle physics, and an extensive customization system all affect the gameplay in a meaningful way."

 

EDIT: I'm bored so went and added up all my vehicle hours up between Bf3 and 4, it's actually a little less than I thought it was; it's only approximately 1605 hours in vehicles (although this is missing time from 1 of my Bf3 accounts as I can't remember the log in details, email or password :/) ... Guess I'm just a vehicle noob after all.

Edited by VoodooGaming
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Good day Dear community
I think everyone has their favorite weapon, class or even vehicle.
A sniper would not like to be disturbed by a tank or a tank from a Pioneer with mines or RPG.
it is a dilemma!
There has to be a solution for all involved. Tank Must not be made easier for pioneers or vice versa
All participants should be able to master your chosen class.chalnge brings the game fun

Everyone has to be irresolutely satisfied and that's where the problem starts !!

We must not forget that we only talk about a game
But we do not have to forget a few things that a tank is a tank

-Please increase gun barrel swivel speed
-HE- Increase the radius a little
-qoaxial gun shot cadence increase
-increase the speed of the tank
-reduce damage to sight,

Compremis between 1 th and last patch

 

I'm good at sniping but I do not like campe
If there was a big map with a long distansen, I would like to play long range sniper that I enjoy more
I like to play as tank hunters, mines (where the mines destroy a tank altogether, D are invisible)
I like to play attackers and like to pick flags
Alone I rarely play, most I play with a full squad communication: TS
Act tactically and enjoy the game is my game way

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problem is vehicles got decimated in latest paches, and there were no complains about RPG's though there was a topic about mines and the way they were implemented. I think the main problem with any vehicle is that, they are not truly modular. Yes you have optics and add on armor, but track, engine, gun barrel and turret ring aren't flushed out. With more detailed DMG model of vehicles some complains should disappear. That way vehicles could retain their former fire power and could get buff to over all structural integrity. 

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I've kinda lost interest in the game a little since the vehicles have been nerfed so hard, or at least find myself playing a lot less since 0.2. despite the actual game running the best it has to date (apart from some server/ network rubberbanding occasionally). For me it's had a real negative effect on the 'gameplay loop' grinding away all game (if your lucky enough to be in a round from the start) just to get a vehicle close to the end of the round which at best is now meh and is as easily destroyed as ever. It just doesn't feel very rewarding or immersive now :(

 

So far concerning vehicles it's been all take and no give, at least buff defensive strength with offensive nerf.

Edited by VoodooGaming
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18 hours ago, VoodooGaming said:

I've kinda lost interest in the game a little since the vehicles have been nerfed so hard, or at least find myself playing a lot less since 0.2. despite the actual game running the best it has to date (apart from some server/ network rubberbanding occasionally). For me it's had a real negative effect on the 'gameplay loop' grinding away all game (if your lucky enough to be in a round from the start) just to get a vehicle close to the end of the round which at best is now meh and is as easily destroyed as ever. It just doesn't feel very rewarding or immersive now :(

 

So far concerning vehicles it's been all take and no give, at least buff defensive strength with offensive nerf.

Tanks  were given many customization options and will get more in the future, so you can config your vehicle to suit your playstyle. 

Do you want to be more agile yet have a decent protection? Go without the additional armor but with APS so you can hit and run.

Do you want to be more tanky? Use additional armor plates.

Do you feel threatened by enemy's infantry? Go to action with your teammates/ squadmates.

You seem to forget how powerful RCWSs are. Teamed up with a buddy in RCWS you can really decimate enemy and have a decent protection against backstabbing.

 

Thermal vision, smoke grenades, APS, RCWS, secondary machine gun, additional armor for turrets and body this is your arsenal and above all - you can repair in the base.

 

I agree that tankers should be more engaged at close and med distance combat instead of sniping from afar so this will be our next goal to achieve.

 

 

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@Kony I think a big part I think is 'having it all' (Terminator was a beast to begin with) and now losing some/ a lot of that power, smokes kinda useless now (2 just isn't enough for a sustained attack on heavily defended objective) I don't understand why the smoke got nerfed so hard in 1 pass 5>2 60% reduction in 1 pass. RCWS doesn't exist on my main vehicle and when on a MBT hardly anyone uses it (waste of BP most the time), I get the feeling people don't like to jump into the MBT's because they know how easily they're destroyed, 1-3 tandem RPG's that any soldier can carry and resupply themselves (kind of makes soldiers more of a tank than actual MBT's lol).

 

A lot of the time when I say vehicles I actually mean the terminator, it's by far my personal favorite; and IMO best suited from the current vehicle selection to the current maps (it's basically what it was designed for, am I wrong?). I guess the terminator is a tough one to balance with it being a mixture of both IFV and MBT support vehicle, but I think you've been a little to aggressive nerfing so much of it's offensive capabilities in such a short time, the loaded ammo being reduced from 30>20 wasn't too bad; but the recent splash damage reduction has pretty much made HE and SH pointless with you having to be so accurate with them that you'd might had well just use the 7.62 or 12.7mm instead; and good luck trying to hit infantry who are popping in and out of small cover firing RPG's now, istn't that the point of splash damage; infantry with RPG seem more than happy now to go 1v1 with a terminator providing they have the slightest of cover and RPG ammo which they can deploy themselves.

 

The combination of nerfs, increase in BP cost and the shorter game rounds have had a real negative effect on the gameplay loop for me personally, I like vehicles and vehicles combined with squad/ team based objective gameplay is what attracted me to WW3; it's early access and I understand pretty much everything is subject to change, I'm here for the long haul but I just don't have that urge to play much since 0.2. which is a shame because I was really enjoying WW3.

Edited by VoodooGaming
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I haven't read everything but I'm going to throw my opinion here anyways

I think the nerfs are justified. They help promote 1 thing that the entire game is designed around: teamplay. Yeah, a tank can be destroyed relatively easily. I've got 30 hours in this game and I can say the reason they get destroyed is because they are either driven by idiots who want to drive right up completely flanked on all sides by potential infantry and/or not utilizing infantry support in the slightest.

The time I have kicked ass and seen people kick ass in tanks, even after the nerf, is when they work closely with the infantry. The follow their push, they are aware of the frontline, and they accept that they aren't the star of the show refraining from driving out in the open for kills.

If a tank can be an absolute 1 man killing machine, there is a problem. It completely negates the importance of coordination with infantry which I think is a bigger sin than any sort of damage nerfs can be.

Edited by aceb20
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@aceb20(I've got 133 hours in game) Problem is it doesn't take teamwork to take a vehicle down, 1 infantry + their own ammo resupply can easily take down a vehicle (and I mean easily, even from distance); even more so since splash damage nerf. Basically it seems like your saying a vehicle (a reward for playing well and a combat multiplier) should have to rely on teamwork (I some what agree to a certain extent), but it's good that a single soldier can easily take out a vehicle without teamwork... So essentially vehicles need teamwork, infantry don't need teamwork. Maybe if vehicles are going to be considered this way they should just spawn at base on a timer (like Battlefield) or cost substantially less BP considering how easily 1 soldier can destroy them. Also it's really hard to teamplay without voip.

Edited by VoodooGaming
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Should this be the mentality a single soldier should have toward vehicles? No need to fear vehicles in WW3, no need for teamwork to destroy vehicles in WW3.

I know you're going to say the MBT probably did a fair bit of damage to the IFV, but regardless 2 tandems would of destroyed it. Shouldn't a single infantry fear going head to head with pretty much any vehicle rather than fancying their chances in a 1v1 with it...

I've got many clips like this, just got to find the time to edit them into a compilation/ montage.

Edited by VoodooGaming
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even before infamous paches tanks and IFV were hilariously easy to take out but at least they had firepower, but now they have nether firepower or protection and they cost a lot more since battles are a lot shorter...

edit(i watched the vid):

I have 5 very "easy" fixes to vehicles that won't flip balance 180deg.

-add a bit more survivability to APC's

-remove .50 coaxial and add 7.62mm MG with 500-1000R (only AP, FMJ or mixed belts). 0.50cal is the biggest killer of infantry 

-Bring back HE/HS blast radius, or even make it slightly bigger but add reload time for HE/SH

-Add fixed ammo loadouts for high caliber guns, i would go RL load outs that are ap(armor piercing) 2:1 chem(chemical)  or ap 3:1 chem. The same philosophy can be applied to auto- canons but proportions should be ap 1:1 chem. 

-Add track damage.

 

Edited by Marg
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7 hours ago, Kony said:

Tanks  were given many customization options and will get more in the future, so you can config your vehicle to suit your playstyle. 

Do you want to be more agile yet have a decent protection? Go without the additional armor but with APS so you can hit and run.

Do you want to be more tanky? Use additional armor plates.

Do you feel threatened by enemy's infantry? Go to action with your teammates/ squadmates.

You seem to forget how powerful RCWSs are. Teamed up with a buddy in RCWS you can really decimate enemy and have a decent protection against backstabbing.

 

Thermal vision, smoke grenades, APS, RCWS, secondary machine gun, additional armor for turrets and body this is your arsenal and above all - you can repair in the base.

 

I agree that tankers should be more engaged at close and med distance combat instead of sniping from afar so this will be our next goal to achieve.

 

 

The main problem with a lot of the customization options right now is they, and the vehicles themselves, are honestly too expensive to call in most games at the moment, IMO.  

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i am 95% time user of terminator :) which is little bit funny these days, enemy ATs have absolutely no respect to me but its ok.. with best pasive + active protection and 2x30mm its possible to deal with them.. you just need to keep distance.. all tanks are extremely vulnerable agaist infantry at close range (like IRL) 

but what i want to say.. in 80% i lost wehicle its because i simply fall down under the map or i get shoot to the moon.. its near every game i play..  drive over some kind of bump its nearly suicide.. and this thing makes me really crazy..

....time to get 5-6k points is ok for me, when you are squadleader and your mates works like a team.. its possible under 5min , most often it takes 5-8min, so how long is round? 10-15min?

in most games im able to use t-72(about 5850points) 2 times..(most often because i fall down under the map with first one)

20181124133739_1.jpg

20181126233913_1.jpg

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so @lipo you are camping corner of the map and just racking up kills... because if you wan to be any useful to your team you need to play caps... and in 80% locations it's basically impossible to keep far distance (hard to get hit by RPG) and effectively support your infantry.

Also i daub you could get 13k points almost every game in current version since battles rarely last longer than 20min, top scores for better team leaders are usually 12k-14k very rare 17k  in the END , and it's rare to get even 7k in first 10min(half time of current battles)

i call BS 

or you play with THE SQUAD so we do not talk about it since game doesn't support voice chat

Edited by Marg
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@Marg all my movement depends on situation, its quite easy to get overrun by infantry without support.. so whem i am somewhere alone, yes i am camping in safe and waiting for support.. but when there is some team members trying to cap why not to help them? in most cases vehicle can eat about 3-4RPGs, with APS, even more..  

just take a look at the screenshots.. 17-19mins left (about 2k score for my team..)

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Suggestion to improve tanks.

MBT: Make it a 3 man tank Driver, Main gunner, and Top gunner/Commander.
-Driver has access to third person camera and a smoke generator
-Main Gunner HE and shrapnel rounds have old blast radious, 50cal and 7,62 both do full damage and fire rate, additional zoom level longer range and access to termal optics, cannot do third person
-Top Turret Full damage and fire rate from the turret, access to longer range magnification and termal optics cannot do third person, access to smoke gernades.

MBT: Alot tougher takes at least 2 hits to the rear of tandem, front and side ruffly 7 RPG hits to disable(cannot fight back), add new damage state tracks stops vechicle from moving and thus from falling back, Land mines do minor damage and track the tank

AFV: Again 3 man with Driver, main gunner and commander main advantage of this is it should be alot cheaper than a MBT almost half the price at base but as a trade off much weaker and very unlikely to win in a fight with a MBT, but at a significant advantage vrs IFVs and especially infantry with its Autocannon. Also due to the versatility of the Auto cannon it should be less relient on the top turret therefor making it a effective 2 man tank.

IFV: Same price as a AFV but is a 2 man crew with driver and main gunner being one person with the usual optional top turret. This gives a solo tank option trade off is due to having lighter armor can be one hit to rear armor by a tandem also very weak vrs even Auto cannons giving it a weakness to AFVs

Additional: Tank optical buff, much slower replenishment of Main gun ammo this is in attempt to make tankers try to use the MGs to kill infantry and only put a HE out if the Infantry is dug in, it should be a very powerful round but thus should be a limited round thats used sparingly at the risk of running out if one wastes them on ammo if they then come against a MBT they may be found wanting for ammo. If the Tor still does like 10% damage per shot then it needs nerfing into the ground vrs tanks as thats just silly.

Tanks should be easier to disable than destroy, perhaps even a chance that if a shot goes internal it could kill a crew memeber, things that could be damageable, tracks, loader/breach, turret ring, Engine, ammo racks which could cause a burn off requiring the tank to return to base for repairs and a lenghty re arming.

Suggestion on RPGs:
-Add a max weight to character building To run RPG and heavy armor should require sacrifice my suggestion is make the max gun you can use with RPG plus heavy armor be a SMG and not able to carry a bit equipment like Med pack, Ammo pack and Gear Pack making RPG guys require a ammo bearer to launch many RPGs
-Allow RPGs to carry as many Rockets of as many types as they want at the cost of weight with Weight being from lowest to highest Frag, Single and Tandem
-RPG shots should be able to disable the track of a tank thus stopping it from fleeing

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3people to operate a tank in game? Please no ?.

 

Although i wouldnt mind that at all if that was implemented on new forest map with vehicles only mode?

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Thats why i suggest making IFVs solo freindly, in fiarness about 75% of a AFV and MBT would be functional from 2 players driver and gunner, which we already kinda have as to get full effect out of a tank you need 2 people its just the second is more a optional extra than a team work required.

I guess it comes down to taste, on one hand I want team work to be required to both effectively operate and fight tanks, but i can see why people would prefer it to be soloable especially if they typically dont play with freinds. Its my prefernce simply because iam used to the idea of tanks being multiplayer vehicles and thus can be made powerful to the point that they feel like a tank, other games need tanks to be watered down because its one player commitment which just rubs me up the wrong way.

 

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On 11/30/2018 at 4:08 AM, Draugr543154 said:

Thats why i suggest making IFVs solo freindly, in fiarness about 75% of a AFV and MBT would be functional from 2 players driver and gunner, which we already kinda have as to get full effect out of a tank you need 2 people its just the second is more a optional extra than a team work required.

I guess it comes down to taste, on one hand I want team work to be required to both effectively operate and fight tanks, but i can see why people would prefer it to be soloable especially if they typically dont play with freinds. Its my prefernce simply because iam used to the idea of tanks being multiplayer vehicles and thus can be made powerful to the point that they feel like a tank, other games need tanks to be watered down because its one player commitment which just rubs me up the wrong way.

 

game doesn't have voice chat, that would be like one deaf trying convey message to another deaf by shouting, and hoping that driver will be what so ever competent and wont throw your hardly earned 7K BP by smashing into infantry positions like a retarded seal into rocky shore... there should be option for Multi-crewing but only option.... not necessity. Also tanks aren't that easy to drive even by solo player, and duo team if well coordinated would totally destroy enemy team since you would have another pair of eyes  and gunner didn't have to worry about 2nd the most distracting thing, driving.

Edited by Marg
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7 hours ago, Marg said:

game doesn't have voice chat, that would be like one deaf trying convey message to another deaf by shouting, and hoping that driver will be what so ever competent and wont throw your hardly earned 7K BP by smashing into infantry positions like a retarded seal into rocky shore... there should be option for Multi-crewing but only option.... not necessity. Also tanks aren't that easy to drive even by solo player, and duo team if well coordinated would totally destroy enemy team since you would have another pair of eyes  and gunner didn't have to worry about 2nd the most distracting thing, driving.

Game wouldnt need it Iam very rarely queing into this game on my own and thus communicate with squadmates via discord or TS, my point is there would be a option the APC , there would be a option for 2 man groups the AFV and there would be options for 3 man groups MBT.

Also as someone who does drive tanks alot in WW3 and can often keep the tank alive the entire match id have to disagree on it not being easy, granted its also easy to take out tanks my second favorite thing to do in this game, i would much rather it require team work to both operate and destroy a tank.

But again this is my preference


 

Edited by Draugr543154

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